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Are Jews Master Race?
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Date: April 10th, 2015 6:06 PM Author: unholy point potus Reminder that for the Nazis the Master Race meant not "people with whips" but "definers and drivers of civilization", the master-slave relationship as defined by Hegel.
So, are Jews now a master race? |
Date: April 10th, 2015 6:06 PM Author: impressive milk marketing idea SPOILER ALERT . . . . . . . . . . . . yeah |
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Date: April 23rd, 2015 2:08 AM Author: impressive milk marketing idea (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#27742356) |
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Date: June 6th, 2018 3:48 PM Author: Concupiscible public bath circlehead (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#36195467) |
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Date: April 10th, 2015 6:08 PM Author: Dun racy heaven they took huge losses in WW2 (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#27666629) |
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Date: April 10th, 2015 6:31 PM Author: unholy point potus As far as Germans were concerned, Jews were the only serious completion for dat cozy Master Race spot. Also, Ashkenazis are much closer to Germans genetically then to Russian ARE Reptile types. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#27666790) |
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Date: April 10th, 2015 6:46 PM Author: Ruddy set Then what are they doing in Palestine? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#27666883) |
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Date: April 10th, 2015 6:53 PM Author: unholy point potus Mistakes were made... (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#27666919) |
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Date: April 10th, 2015 6:54 PM Author: Amber razzle stage ashkenazis are wops. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#27666931) |
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Date: April 10th, 2015 9:50 PM Author: comical philosopher-king national security agency Except no. Ashkenazim are not Central Europeans who "happen to" practice Judaism; whole-genome data unambiguously reveal that they remain a little shy of 50% Near Eastern, and that their European admixture (which inconveniently enough seems to have been largely female-mediated — look at the mitochondrial haplogroups) is preponderantly southern, probably mostly Italian, acquired early on, before endogamy grew rigid. This is the great achievement of the Ashkenazi Jews — survival as a true human island, like some impermeable Indian caste, through century upon century of battering by an ocean of hostile aliens.
Arguably the low East Asian admixture in Russians does not draw them so far out of "genetic Europe", and they certainly have more commonality of ancestry with Germans than do Yidden.
http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/files/jewpc3.jpg |
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Date: April 10th, 2015 10:04 PM Author: unholy point potus What's close and what's not as far as civilization building qualities are concerned will become clear only after specific genes are mapped to specific traits. Here you are mostly looking at such traits as earwax chemistry. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#27668151) |
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Date: April 11th, 2015 12:57 AM Author: comical philosopher-king national security agency You're dumb. "genetic closeness" has an actual meaning, though I guess you just want a smokescreen for "innate civilizational potential". The population history is clear. Genomewide datasets of variants which segregate as a function of ancestry tell us that Ashkenazi Jews have very little Germanic ancestry and share less genetic history with Germans than do Russians. If there are such things as "civilization alleles", then either they're inheritances from deeper in the tree with independent selective histories on the German and Ashkenazi lineages (and they only rose to high freq there?) or they're two different sets
but at any rate, you forget that middleman minorities don't really stake their reputations on the *building* part of civilization-building |
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Date: April 11th, 2015 2:26 AM Author: unholy point potus Fuck you for making me read this pile of crap. I guess clear thought expression allele data sets failed to segregate from intestinal gas expulsion allele data sets somewhere in your individual phenotype development as a function of heavy metal intrusion into your ancestral inheritance chain at some stage of your fetal development. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#27669364) |
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Date: April 11th, 2015 8:38 AM Author: comical philosopher-king national security agency (didn't understand a single sentence, in denial that Jews are LEVANTINE ALIENS, thinks Mercurians "build" civilizations instead of having them handed to them ready-made.)
yeah here's a question for you: how many fixed coding-region differences are there between Neanderthals and modern humans (or let's say modern NW Europeans)?
Anyway, the answer to the original question is no. catastrophic intermarriage rates today shows that their pride of race was only a matter of host hostility. as soon as they got a chance at shiksa orifices and goyishe fluids all that talmudic eyestrain went straight out the window. secondly, jewish attainment is purely white-collar. little boys' playacting like in the "tough" Israeli state betrays a hysterical overreacting character that is essentially feminine (seen also in their ineptness at the visual arts) -- here we have a people of mercantile and scholastic bearing for whom open assertions of power are entirely foreign, as is ironically betrayed by the aggressiveness and highly personalized acidity of Jewish argumentation. that kind of conduct is only possible in creatures who cannot conceive of physical consequences for their actions, soft hands running string around their shtetls. no such people could ever dominate.
admixture with oriental jews, even swarthy africanized stocks like the yemenite, is in israel today returning ashkenazim to their roots. here we have more dynamic possibility. they will not too long from now once again enforce the veil, practice polygamy unashamed, and (I hope) wet red the stone of the rebuilt Temple. when it becomes a routine thing for the Jews to retaliate against the latest Arab outrage with their own suicide bombers, you will know it is complete. the greatness of the Israelite was not intellectual. it was in the ferocity of his iconoclasm. |
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Date: April 12th, 2015 5:40 PM Author: unholy point potus Mercurians? The whole poast is such a bizarre mix. Cant tell if serious.
Anyway, good points on many accounts. |
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Date: June 6th, 2018 3:58 PM Author: Naked Curious Theater Stage Messiness (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#36195527) |
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Date: June 6th, 2018 4:00 PM Author: Razzmatazz business firm generalized bond (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#36195545) |
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Date: June 27th, 2019 12:39 AM Author: spectacular twisted lodge jfc (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#38447016) |
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Date: April 10th, 2015 6:49 PM Author: underhanded brass background story yes (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#27666899) |
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Date: April 10th, 2015 6:53 PM Author: Carnelian up-to-no-good stead lol no (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#27666921) |
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Date: April 10th, 2015 6:53 PM Author: khaki fragrant haunted graveyard institution Explain then why only Askenazi's (with european intermixing and european heritage) are prominent overachievers in science/engineering/arts/nobel while Sephardics haven't done much of note.
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Date: April 10th, 2015 6:57 PM Author: unholy point potus I should have specified Askenazi Jews. I am talking genetics here. Sephardics are grandfathered as retarded cousins-in-law. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#27666956) |
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Date: April 10th, 2015 7:04 PM Author: khaki fragrant haunted graveyard institution so you agree it is nothing specific/special about jews but rather the europeans (askenazis are people who lived and intermarried for centuries in europe) that are high achievers.
You look at nobel prize winners and it is all einstein, schekman,perlmutter,steinman etc etc. Not exactly biblical jewish names |
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Date: April 10th, 2015 7:16 PM Author: unholy point potus I don't think defining them as European helps, because the Irish, Southern Italians, Serbs are also European. But yes there is something in Europe that influenced some of the people living in Europe to be able to advance the civilization. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#27667085) |
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Date: April 10th, 2015 7:19 PM Author: khaki fragrant haunted graveyard institution lol at advancing civilization argument. they rose to prominence in last century and have nothing to do with the real seminal events in human civilization (romans, greeks ,ancient chinese , gutenberg , Martin Luther King , Industrial revolution etc)
EDIT: Ofcourse Martin Luther. Obviously it should have been clear from the chronology |
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Date: April 10th, 2015 7:20 PM Author: unholy point potus Martin Luther King or Martin Luther?
Also, Spinoza if you want a good example before XIX century
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baruch_Spinoza |
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Date: April 10th, 2015 7:20 PM Author: Violet excitant library depressive lol at your MLK trolling - you mean Martin Luther, right? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#27667123) |
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Date: June 27th, 2019 12:29 AM Author: Out-of-control foreskin tbf modern Europeans had fuck all to do with MLK too. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#38446965) |
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Date: April 10th, 2015 7:25 PM Author: bateful opaque kitchen I don't get why you play this stupid semantic game in every thread about jews.
no one is saying anything about anything other than ashkenazi jews.
if you are actually arguing that there is no genetic difference between ashkenazi jews and any other european/german group, then you are arguing against something that was settled long ago. |
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Date: April 10th, 2015 7:26 PM Author: khaki fragrant haunted graveyard institution Well go back and read the thread title to see why I am making this argument (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#27667155) |
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Date: April 10th, 2015 7:28 PM Author: bateful opaque kitchen your argument has nothing to do with the thread title unless you're arguing that ashkenazi jews are not a separate race from, e.g., germans.
since i'm guessing you're not intentionally making unrelated argumetns, i can only assume that you're arguing that there's no difference between ashkenazi jews and other european groups. |
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Date: April 10th, 2015 7:37 PM Author: khaki fragrant haunted graveyard institution i consider askenazis as distinct european group like italians/spanish/germans/french.
This is not a scientific argument but philosophical. Arguing jews are special is not correct when you consider achievements (rather lack of) of sephardics and other jewish groups.
Over the last 600-800 years europeans have been responsible for major advancements in human condition. Sometime it is Italians during renaissance period , sometimes it is the french or english or germans. In the last 100-150 years or so askenazis have played an important vital role in this process. |
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Date: April 10th, 2015 8:13 PM Author: bateful opaque kitchen these threads are clearly about ashkenazi jews. no one is arguing that mizrachi or sephardic jews have had anywhere near the same impact as ashkenazis.
similarly, no one is arguing that sephardic and/or mizrachi jews are that similar to each other or to asheknazis.
what i don't get is why you always lead people (me) down a subthread wasteland about this every time anyone mentions jews. |
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Date: April 10th, 2015 8:23 PM Author: khaki fragrant haunted graveyard institution i have been posting for less than a week so i think you are confusing me with somebody else (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#27667479) |
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Date: April 10th, 2015 8:23 PM Author: lime trailer park (kike supremacist) (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#27667481) |
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Date: April 10th, 2015 6:55 PM Author: Violet excitant library depressive No, can't survive without a host society (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#27666938) |
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Date: April 10th, 2015 6:56 PM Author: Carnelian up-to-no-good stead (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#27666947) |
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Date: April 10th, 2015 7:10 PM Author: unholy point potus Explain Israel. Also, many Jews were very patriotic during WWI, including, ironically, the inventor of Zyclon A pesticide.
Had Hitler adopted "integrate at any cost" policy instead of letting his butthurt take over, things would have worked out much better in the end. |
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Date: April 10th, 2015 7:16 PM Author: Violet excitant library depressive Israel is a bubble. It's not going to last. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#27667083) |
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Date: April 10th, 2015 7:17 PM Author: appetizing pearly menage jewess you're done here
Boyer's one prior attempt to discuss his Jewish background ended in disaster. Asked by a Jewish newspaper what he thought Israel should do about its hostile neighbors, he replied that "if China moves across the border to threaten Israel, I will personally COME over there to beat them into submission with my massive FUCKSTICK!" |
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Date: April 10th, 2015 6:56 PM Author: Amber razzle stage >Reminder that for the Nazis the Master Race meant not "people with whips" but "definers and drivers of civilization", the master-slave relationship as defined by Hegel.
on a per capita basis, american boomer jews are probably the most influential cohort of people in history. |
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Date: April 10th, 2015 6:58 PM Author: Violet excitant library depressive lol, thanks guys (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#27666959) |
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Date: April 10th, 2015 7:01 PM Author: Supple immigrant fortuitous meteor Sorry to burst your bubble, but Jews are literally the antithesis of a master race. Small, nebbish, whiny, greasy, ugly losers whose butthole wasteland of a state was given out of pity for being helplessly murdered like droves of insects. Yeah, total master race. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#27666986) |
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Date: April 10th, 2015 7:12 PM Author: appetizing pearly menage jewess sup hassan, how's living in a hole in lebanon going for you? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#27667065) |
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Date: April 10th, 2015 7:16 PM Author: Supple immigrant fortuitous meteor (duplicitous kike) (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#27667086) |
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Date: April 10th, 2015 7:17 PM Author: appetizing pearly menage jewess (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#27667097) |
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Date: April 10th, 2015 7:30 PM Author: Vermilion provocative organic girlfriend pocket flask cr (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#27667172) |
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Date: April 10th, 2015 9:24 PM Author: Startling Round Eye (goy who thinks nebbish is an adjective) (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#27667879) |
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Date: April 11th, 2015 1:33 AM Author: Glittery range twinkling uncleanness So, physical characteristics are all that matter? Money talks, man. And money is power. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#27669203) |
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Date: April 10th, 2015 7:23 PM Author: Sable Candlestick Maker Volcanic Crater Nietzsche seemed to think they were (or at least that they would be eventually) (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#27667134) |
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Date: April 10th, 2015 7:29 PM Author: unholy point potus Could you elaborate? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#27667170) |
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Date: April 10th, 2015 7:40 PM Author: Sable Candlestick Maker Volcanic Crater "And then where shall an outlet be found for this abundant wealth of great impressions accumulated during such an extended period and representing Jewish history for every Jewish family, this wealth of passions, virtues, resolutions, resignations, struggles, and conquests of all kinds—where can it find an outlet but in great intellectual men and works! On the day when the Jews will be able to exhibit to us as their own work such jewels and golden vessels as no European nation, with its shorter and less profound experience, can or could produce, when Israel shall have changed its eternal vengeance into [pg 214] an eternal benediction for Europe: then that seventh day will once more appear when old Jehovah may rejoice in Himself, in His creation, in His chosen people—and all, all of us, will rejoice with Him!"
"The Jews, however, are beyond all doubt the strongest, toughest, and purest race at present living in Europe, they know how to succeed even under the worst conditions (in fact better than under favourable ones)" |
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Date: April 10th, 2015 7:42 PM Author: Supple immigrant fortuitous meteor So Jews are cockroaches? Got it. an impotent, priestly class. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#27667243) |
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Date: April 10th, 2015 7:48 PM Author: Amber razzle stage >the Jews will be able to exhibit to us as their own work such jewels and golden vessels as no European nation, with its shorter and less profound experience, can or could produce
this is all bullshit. jews are high-achieving for basically only two reasons:
-higher-than-average IQ scores and a culture that values intellectual pursuits -"rootlessness", i.e. lack of connection to gentile traditions, see things from an outsider's perspective and from a more abstract point of view. (this one is a double-edged sword -- it also makes them more inclined to fall in love with retarded ideas like communism).
that's basically ashkenazi achievement in a nutshell. |
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Date: April 10th, 2015 8:00 PM Author: Amber razzle stage I guess you could say there's a third reason: a desire to overcome their status as a minority group and ensure their group's position in society. if you don't want the man to keep you down, you gotta rise up any way you can. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#27667360) |
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Date: April 10th, 2015 8:01 PM Author: unholy point potus A culture that values intellectual pursuits - same can be said of the European educated class
Rootlessness? That is bullshit. Jews are just as rooted in Judaism as Northern German Lutherans in Protestantism or Bavarians in Catholicism. In 1900 it appeared that all three could have felt at home in Germany (and Europe). That's what he is writing about |
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Date: April 11th, 2015 1:21 AM Author: Vermilion provocative organic girlfriend pocket flask Rootlessnes - having no homeland, no patriotism, not assimilating (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#27669169) |
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Date: April 11th, 2015 2:26 AM Author: Glittery range twinkling uncleanness sounds about like the gays (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#27669363) |
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Date: April 10th, 2015 7:51 PM Author: unholy point potus changing eternal vengeance into an eternal benediction for Europe...
Not flame. In 1900s, so close. Almost... |
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Date: April 10th, 2015 8:22 PM Author: unholy point potus ty (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#27667475) |
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Date: April 10th, 2015 9:28 PM Author: Chocolate stage I think they are (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#27667902) |
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Date: April 11th, 2015 1:20 AM Author: aqua mexican jap far from it
one thing is that they are not a race at all, rather just a huge and slimily extended mafia with its own iron internal rules
but most important is that their "business idea" as a culture and group is just systematically preying on functioning societies, cultures, institutions, people and countries. As a group they always subtract from the QoL of their hosts and neighbours. |
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Date: June 6th, 2018 3:47 PM Author: avocado pit striped hyena (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#36195460) |
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Date: April 11th, 2015 2:07 AM Author: Peach Embarrassed To The Bone Shrine Bbw jews are higher functioning gypsies (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#27669305) |
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Date: April 11th, 2015 2:21 AM Author: violent swashbuckling cruise ship coffee pot (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#27669357) |
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Date: April 12th, 2015 5:50 PM Author: aqua mexican jap very much so, even if the Gypsies lack the powers of infiltration and thus just resort to small-time crimes, robberies, begging and swindles. but yes, the mind-sets are in some ways very similar, including eternal public screams for victim status even as they simultaneously rip off others
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Date: April 11th, 2015 1:50 PM Author: Aggressive canary bawdyhouse knife Thorstein Veblen's essay The Intellectual Pre-Eminence of Jews in Modern Europe is a good read. Basically jews can operate in goy academics but still retain an outsiders perspective which fosters skepticism and questioning of assumptions. He also predicts zionist fulfillment and how it will obviate the advantage. Pretty astute. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#27670839) |
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Date: April 12th, 2015 5:55 PM Author: aqua mexican jap Veblen was good, but there was not an "intellectual pre-eminence of Jews". Just ALSO a lot of Jews taking part in the larger European society (many of whom were de facto part-Jews or even converted) (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#27677957) |
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Date: April 16th, 2015 7:04 PM Author: Aggressive canary bawdyhouse knife No offense but fuck you he's my hero (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#27704043) |
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Date: April 12th, 2015 5:48 PM Author: aqua mexican jap (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#27677921) |
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Date: April 16th, 2015 7:02 PM Author: unholy point potus (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#27704029) |
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Date: April 12th, 2015 5:52 PM Author: Fantasy-prone Topaz Crackhouse Stain The older I get, the more alluring I find pale, mischievous jewesses (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#27677944) |
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Date: April 12th, 2015 5:56 PM Author: aqua mexican jap pale yes, but mischievousness would depend on whether they would be good or bad at heart (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#27677968) |
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Date: April 12th, 2015 5:59 PM Author: Fantasy-prone Topaz Crackhouse Stain A dense fragrant thicket of hair, a wild gleam in her eye, a clannishness at once beguiling and repellent... (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#27677982) |
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Date: June 6th, 2018 3:46 PM Author: Razzmatazz business firm generalized bond (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#36195455) |
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Date: June 6th, 2018 3:56 PM Author: Razzle-dazzle dull newt (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#36195517) |
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Date: June 6th, 2018 3:57 PM Author: Talented parlour skinny woman I, for one, welcome our Jewish overlords. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#36195523) |
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Date: June 6th, 2018 8:08 PM Author: unholy point potus Thanks for the bump. Read my poasts with considerable interest. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#36197053) |
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Date: June 7th, 2018 6:11 PM Author: unholy point potus (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#36202772) |
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Date: June 6th, 2018 8:11 PM Author: marvelous center toilet seat I'm literally the worst Jew ever and am still better than all of you so yeah. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#36197072) |
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Date: June 6th, 2018 8:13 PM Author: indigo disrespectful chad roast beef pay homage to rockmeal, you FUCK (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#36197094) |
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Date: June 7th, 2018 6:13 PM Author: unholy point potus lol at you making insect noises in this thread (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#36202791) |
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Date: October 6th, 2018 3:16 AM Author: insane kitty den disappointed to see who the OP is (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#36970882) |
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Date: October 7th, 2018 8:45 PM Author: unholy point potus I am here to provoke thought. The actual thought is up to you.
Just read Wikipedia for the definition of "master race". What a pile of horseshit. Master race is people capable of building a society that advances the civilization forward. Slave races copy. it's not a master/slave relationship in a literal sense.
They either are or they are not.
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Date: October 7th, 2018 9:18 PM Author: unholy point potus Also, a reminder:
Hitler wanted to set up Israel, but the diabolical Anglo merchants, and yes, Jew bankers interfered at every stage.
Israel appears to be doing OK. Recently a virulently shitlib Jew told me he is not a "Zionist" when I asked him if he ever visited Israel.
It's not as simple. |
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Date: October 7th, 2018 9:20 PM Author: violent maniacal school cafeteria Thanks KUSHJEW (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#36981521) |
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Date: June 27th, 2019 12:43 AM Author: aphrodisiac milky tattoo clown Jews are like the diabolically clever 'Dark Force' in a fairy tale that the heroic -- but guileless and naive -- HUWHITE Knight must confront in order to shed his innocence and come to a complete understanding of the world. Jews were put here to test us, to shine a light on the dark side of human nature. Confronting the Jew marks our loss of illusion. But we will come thru it stronger. |
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Date: April 14th, 2026 11:18 PM Author: unholy point potus (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2852465&forum_id=2#49818330) |